Ralph, The 400 Burgman I borrowed was a 2016 with only 3k on the clock, it suited me on riding position/leg room and had sufficient power, but was not a happy experience otherwise. The ride was really poor on all but perfect tarmac, jarring on every rode irregularity and it felt unstable at motorway speed so I decided not to take my pillion out and handed it back. Admittedly it was my 1st outing on a maxi scoot, and I know plenty of owners here rate the Burgman highly.

Hi Peter, we are not experienced scooter owners having only had two, we don't own a car so 90% of the time we are two up plus shopping or what ever.

Our first scoot was the sh300, beautiful nimble scooter 2016 model, but afraid we were asking too much of it and it suffered with premature wear, especially the drive train, didn't even consider the consequences when buying however we were over the maximum recommended payload, which can be hard to find out without the handbook, some just say we were unlucky 7000 miles 2 back tyres, new belt, clutch shoes would of been needed next, this I'm sure due to being overloaded most of the time?

After this we did more research into weights, and we now have a 400 burgman 2018, this had the most available loading for the size of the Japanese options, don't necessarily think bigger is better, ours has more loading than the silver wing, it is early days still only 1070 miles but find it more able and the wife especially finds it more comfortable, think it feels more torquey, it's not very quick of the line compared to others, haven't done any long rides yet but we feel it would be ok? early days, I still think the Honda is better build and finished off but horses for course?

The other concern for us was the fact of getting it onto our trailer to tow behind the motor home, much on the limit for us at 215 kg, and of course tax and insurance, being up to 400cc, then 600cc then over tax brackets, so the 650 is same as a 1000, this of course may not matter a hoot to you? We did also like the 400 Yamaha but not enough weight gain.

So for us up to 400cc it was the burgman that allowed us sufficient loading and fitted our trailer and our tax bracket, we would love to own something bigger, but practicality has to come first, after all much bigger and it would be cheaper to run a car!! But not as much fun, we will have to see ask me again in 12 months time!

Suspect you'd be OK power wise with 400cc from your planned use, but if you want to ensure closer to bike-like ride quality the TMax would probably be a better bet.

If you don't plan to self service the proximity of a decent dealer, or ideally a scooter "qualified" independent, can be a significant factor for selecting a specific marque.

Hi Meldrew, I am referring to the gross weight e.g. the sh300 is rated at 160kg maximum, we now have another 20kg, I don't doubt the silver wing capability of power for cruising, it just has less weight carrying capacity, which for us is a major factor, as I say we are new to this and from our limited experience and reading learning from this forum's advice and knowledge it appears most users are commuters, quite a few have a motorbike as well, very few are two up, and many who tour are doing it solo? Just my observations? If you say around 70 to 80 kilos for a man? Then you are left with plenty of surplus, but add a pillion and most of your allowance is eaten up, I could well be wrong it's only my opinion the way I interpret it? If you question the dealers they have no idea in loading capacities generally

Snail wrote: ↑Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:11 am Hi Meldrew, I am referring to the gross weight e.g. the sh300 is rated at 160kg maximum, we now have another 20kg, I don't doubt the silver wing capability of power for cruising, it just has less weight carrying capacity, which for us is a major factor, as I say we are new to this and from our limited experience and reading learning from this forum's advice and knowledge it appears most users are commuters, quite a few have a motorbike as well, very few are two up, and many who tour are doing it solo? Just my observations? If you say around 70 to 80 kilos for a man? Then you are left with plenty of surplus, but add a pillion and most of your allowance is eaten up, I could well be wrong it's only my opinion the way I interpret it? If you question the dealers they have no idea in loading capacities generally

70-80Kg Snail! Is that averaged between you and Jan?

GVWR and the need to avoid asking too much' of a bike are upper in my list of requirements. I bought my 200 Van Van from a chap who had thought it suitable for pillion use because the dimensions/seat are fine, but as for the demands on the 16hp engine, not fun...
Snail's experience of the Sh300 is cautionary for me as I'm getting interested in the bigger wheel options, (Beverly 350ST), that are billed as capable of 2 up use. I think I'll get down to Midlands Scooter Center to have a look.

If you are looking for a cheap light weight scooter have look at this .
I was impressed with the one i had .

I understand your comments re the rough ride after coming from a bike but the insatiability on the M-way seems a bit
strange, wounder if the tyre pressures were very high.

Hi Ray, in motor home payload calculations the manufacturers allow 75kg for the driver They consider this to be average.

Peter please do your own investigation into scooter carrying capacity, i just mentioned it as like us you said about two up touring and ring any alarm bells before you maybe make a unsuitable purchase?

If only someone would make a 400 twin cylinder shaft drive? Previous to the sh300 we had two Honda innova 125 which must have been severely overweight but never faltered, difference of having a gearbox to take the strain?

Snail wrote: ↑Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:08 am If only someone would make a 400 twin cylinder shaft drive? Previous to the sh300 we had two Honda innova 125 which must have been severely overweight but never faltered, difference of having a gearbox to take the strain?

Would love a twist n go / auto - fixed engine rather than swung unit - with shaft drive rather than a chain... Hydraulic valves - 200 / 250cc...
all my Christmasses...