Kawasaki Hybrid Scoot?

[MrGrumpy]

Slightly interesting article saying that Kawasaki have taken out a patent for a maxi-scoot using the Hybrid tech available in a couple of their bikes.

https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/kaw ... echnology/

Apparently the bikes have been a massive flop - I'm not a sage but from the word go I've said the tech might be of more interest to Maxi-scoot owners. I think the idea sounds interesting, though I've read that the auto box as currently supplied 'needs work', as they say. We shall see....

[mottza]

The z hybrid gear change was very clunky when I test rode one.

[knight2]

I agree, though I'll be the first to admit I don't know enough about the technology involved. I can't understand why they can't make an electric maxi scoot with a decent range, when I take the bodywork off the burgman and look at it there seems to be plenty of room. If they fitted the motor in the rear wheel hub that would leave the space now taken up by the cvt,engine and radiator for batteries, the tech stuff could go under the foot boards where it would be easily accessible should the need arise. Now I'll wait for somebody to tell me why it isn't feasible, I would be interested to know.

[Alan29]

Would the weight of the batteries be an issue?

[knight2]

Possibly, though it weighs 238 kg as is. I also wondered why they don't seem to fit the motor in the wheel hub, maybe unsprung weight maybe a problem there.

[Andym]

Would the weight of the batteries be an issue?

Absolutely. The energy density of current generation batteries is 300 Wh/kg at best, typically half that if affordable. Petrol is 12000 Wh/kg. Even with much less efficient use of the stored energy petrol remains the better source for use without fixed infrastructure.

Electric scooters make sense in a city where you'll travel maybe 20 miles then connect to the charging infrastructure while spending considerable time there (basically going to work where your employer has chargers). Move the pollution away from the dense population.

Hybrids make sense with economies of scale. A 1500cc engine with diesel-electric drive moving 44 tonnes because the engine runs at peak RPM all the time makes sense. A 30cc engine and all the complexity associated with the drive makes no sense to move one person.

These products are just attempts to cash-in on the politics and propaganda associated with EV's. No one is buying them because they are a poor solution. They'll be gone once this is clear. The manufacturers are of course flogging the dead horse to try and make their accountants less grumpy. My own dear employers dug themselves an EV division shaped hole that they will now fill in by giving 15000 Germans early retirement and redundancy payments. The accountants are grumpy and the CEO job is only funding recruiters and suppliers of revolving doors.

Andy

[knight2]

Thanks Andy.
So it seems all the advances in lighter weight more powerful batteries we were told about either aren't in public use yet, or more likely aren't up to the hype.

[roadster]

To use electric motors for final stage power transfer to wheels makes perfect sense because it means that, with a relatively small battery to act as an energy buffer, the internal combustion engine can run at its most efficient whenever required. Engine rpm is then not dictated by any mechanical connection to the wheels. Having no gearbox or clutch is also a saving in weight and cost. This is the reality for cars and allows SUVs such as the Nissan Qashqai to achieve 60 mpg in the real world now. If those in charge would only have understood that a battery, with only 100th of the capacity and weight of an all electric-vehicle battery, could double the efficiency of a low emissions petrol engine we would not be going down this ultimate blind ally.

Transferring this technology to bikes is much more difficult partly because of the investment required to scale down the components. There are also difficulties with regenerative braking on a single track vehicle relying mostly on the front wheel for control. Even so Kawasaki could be the Toyota of the bike manufacturers and I hope they have the same success.

[mottza]

Hybrid bikes are good for a turbo boost as such when you need it.