wozza wrote:

barryG wrote:SYM are probably not popular in Germany because one thing the Germans do well, is recognise quality

So why did BM display poorly made scoors at the NEC last year? Couldn't they spot the poor cheaply made plastics on their new 10k scoots, or perhaps they just weren't embarrassed enough. I've had 2 BMW bikes and they were both shite...never again. There have been a number of engine related problems with some of the newer BM models.

I've also had a near brand new Mercedes car which required a brand new gear box at 10 k miles. No more German Shite for me thanks. That bloody car also had rattling suspension. While my Merc was getting sorted out at the garage I was given a large new saloon to go and play with for the afternoon. While driving along the drivers door mirror started shaking and then fell out. The only thing that stopped it from smashing on the road was the wire for the mirror heater.

German quality my arse.......

You should have seen the state of a Burgman I saw at a regional show in the UK a few years ago - the way the panels were assembled was shocking.

But this is why BMW have delayed sales. They are now due to go on sale in Europe from next month. I imagine quality will be the first thing that the media and owners will publish online. I'll keep an eye out.

There'a Sym Jet I thinks it's a 125 been passing through my village for years daily in all weathers, it still looks as tidy as the first time I saw it, I guess the aged look depends on how they are looked after, like any bike.
Many people have got scooters just for commuting recently and tend not to look after then too well.

capitano wrote:With a lot of the cheaper bikes now, how they fare depends on how mechanically sympathetic and caring their first owner (or parent that has 'invested') is. It sounds like this one learned at the Ginger Phil school of bike maintenance:-

"I was advised to coat the bike in ACF50 but that stuff is so expensive and I was suffering a bit of post purchase penny pinching and bought some £1 cans of 151 damp start from the pound shop thinking they were a cheap wd40 substitute."

I'll have you know I bought a tin of ACF-50 while back. I did the orange LML, the X8, the Neco and now the blue LML.

well i like my sym gts 300i...an had the 250 before. it does all that i ask , an in comfort,safely,with out any worries...so i'm more than happy with mine.

Well I did over 10,300 miles on my SYM GTS EVO 125 during last year (over 52 weeks) including riding right through last winter and have just hit 1,900 miles on my new 300i.

Both bikes have been excellent, there was some superficial rust on the exhaust of the 125 when I traded it in but otherwise it was like new. Only problems I had were a broken spring in the carburetor (the 300 is injection) and the drive belt went at just over 10k miles.

Something which is also important to me is I'm seeing 75 - 87 mpg and I don't take it easy a lot of maxi's don't get anything like that figure.

But this is why BMW have delayed sales. They are now due to go on sale in Europe from next month. I imagine quality will be the first thing that the media and owners will publish online. I'll keep an eye out.

Yeah, surely they should have ensured the "famous German quality" before giving a release date and price, then having to back out for quality issues. Not a very good advert for them! SYM rocks!!

gn2 wrote:Seem to remember the Hayabusa sustaining a (big) number of frame failures which necessitated a recall...?

Could give you a lot more information about that as I was involved in the case that led to it, and it wasn't a problem with the subframe, it was the twonks that owned them...

Oh and the SYM 600 has been canned.

irev wrote:

gn2 wrote:Seem to remember the Hayabusa sustaining a (big) number of frame failures which necessitated a recall...?

Could give you a lot more information about that as I was involved in the case that led to it, and it wasn't a problem with the subframe, it was the twonks that owned them...

Didn't some Honda RC30s have problems with the rear subframe?

irev, nooooooooooooo.......! Has it? Do you mean it's not coming to the UK? No doubt the local dealer will be coming back to me with this info in due course but I'm surprised.

On another note, I think it is difficult to define wether a scooter/bike is good quality just by looking at one that's a year or two old and might be a bit tatty. I've seen some newish but tatty Burgers, Honda's, Yamaha's, BMW's etc etc but I don't count them as poor quality. In fact, Suzuki were joint 3rd with Yamaha on the J D Power bike survey in the States a couple or three years ago for reliability, durability, fit and finish, customer satisfaction etc. First was 'Victory', followed by 'Harley' then jointly, Suzy/Yam. I think many people buy the cheap scooters just to use as a disposable methods of transport and the bikes get minimal looking after so yes there are many tatty ones around. Of course, also how do you define bad quality? It's not just looks, but that would be part of it no doubt. But all bikes have a habbit of looking tatty if not looked after.