Exhaust Baffles

[Funkycowie]

I was curious how the TMax sounds without the baffle in the LeoVince 4Road, its is rather lovely sounding, so I took her for a spin and have to admit I loved hearing it. But I put it back in after a couple of days for legality reasons... even though I don't think its too noisey

But is it really so illegal? and why?

First thing I noticed is pedestrians look in your direction, is that not a good thing? I have had people not look in my direction and start to cross a road requiring me to beep my horn or slow and let them cross dependent on how close they are. Those two days pedestrians were aware of my approach.

Second thing is that car drivers can hear me and that is a very good thing! When filtering or approaching junctions at posted limits I have had cars pulling out, etc. Yet with no baffles when filtering they move out the way or wait and do not pull out.

Watching the Isle of Man TT races with the electric bikes, sure they make a clacking sound, but if that's the silent direction we are headed in with motor vehicles and they all make a similar sound (same engine in everything, no defined differences) is it not going to make it harder for other drivers and especially pedestrians to hear us approach, to differentiate and end up being less aware?

I am curious what others think?

[jjprivate]

for security reasons of course louder is better, I tried my LeoVince without the noise killer also and liked the sound, seemed not too loud for me to be illegal, but still put it back because police here in Germany is very keen to stop riders with illegal exhausts

[darrenandsarah]

It also probably invalidates your insurance removing them.....and definitely does if you mentioned that the exhaust was cosmetic only.

[Funkycowie]

If pedestrians and other road users can hear me coming,without being overly noisy... so therefore adds to accident avoidance... it invalidates my warranty to not have it in?

How does that make sense?

[Earl]

LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES! How can removing the baffles void your insurance? Just putting the pipe on without telling them voids it, but if you've told them you're ok.

[irev]

If pedestrians and other road users can hear me coming,without being overly noisy... so therefore adds to accident avoidance... it invalidates my warranty to not have it in?

How does that make sense?

Loudpipes don't save lives. SMIDSY makes no concessions to `hear you coming`... You're just conning yourself, and trying to fool others if you think having it loud means making it `safe`. Please provide research that independently supports this contention (You won't: There is none. Even the confidential report funded by Hardly-Ableson in US of Freedom of Expression to Annoy every other Fucker remains confidential to this day because IT IS A LIE THAT LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES. And they really, really wanted it to be true as part of their facile attempt to trademark the `potato-potato` sound.

So no, they don't save lives. What they do is:
Irritate people (and there are documented cases of irritated people eventually blowing the brains out of their bike-owning neighbour because of the racket)
They invalidate your warranty because the warranty is dependent on approved products being used - by definition a loud pipe is not approved (can't be under exhaust legislation and the Manufacturer takes their lead from the local rules)
They invalidate your insurance becasue ALL pipes must be homologated and approved to EC standards, or to the appropriate BS equivalent. If not = illegal. Illegal= no insurance.

Trading Standards outline regs as follows:

Regulations to set permissible noise levels for most replacement motorcycle exhaust systems were introduced in August 1996.

This means that replacement silencers and exhaust systems have to be manufactured to meet specific British, European, or International noise reduction Standards.

Under the controls, exhaust systems have to be indelibly marked with the approval mark or the appropriate Standard of compliance.

Examples are shown below:

e 9

or BS AU 193/T2 007

In addition, the packaging in which exhausts are sold must be marked with:

the manufacturer’s name or trade mark and address.
fitting instructions.
instructions, where necessary, for regular maintenance.

The new regulations DO NOT APPLY to the following six categories of exhausts:

silencers and exhaust systems for off-road bikes and which are indelibly marked "NOT FOR ROAD USE".
silencers and exhaust systems for older machines and which are indelibly marked "PRE 1985 MC ONLY".
second-hand exhausts.
exhausts sold fitted to a motorcycle.
silencers and exhaust systems sold for export.
exhausts sold as scrap.

Supplying exhausts which do not meet those requirements may amount to a criminal offence. The penalty can be fine of up to £5,000 and/or a 3 months jail sentence.

Clearly, modification or inappropriate use (such as using a `not for road use` pipe on the road, gives grounds for invalidation of insurance contract. As does failing to inform your insurer, even if doesn't involve increased performance.

If you're so confident, then why have you not told your insurers about your loud pipe and asked for a discount on the basis of `improved safety`..?


Let me proffer just one final counterpoint: If you're bike is THAT LOUD, How do you HEAR SOMETHING ELSE COMING..?

[Funkycowie]

Good point

It did make a nice change in people awareness of me though, but it is amazing how many people on the roads get away with overly noisy cans on their bikes and cars.

I have tried various things to be more present to other road users, none have had as much noticeable effect.

So what about when it comes to electric bikes/cars which are much quieter than petrol vehicles, which in my usual clumsy way was supposed to be the main point of this thread.

[Deeping]

i heard some have an external sound system so they sound like an everyday car

[irev]

Correct. Research has been carried out by Lotus Engineering among others, who can now sound-engineer a vehicle to sound like anything.
One of their developers had a party trick to take a high-revving Flat-Six Subaru and at a certain rev make it suddenly turn into a clickety-clack of a horse and cart. Separately, inside it can sound like a jet fighter taking off or a bunch of farmyard animals.

If you want to improve point-of-presence through sound there is a great deal of research into the modulations, frequencies and doppler-shift effects that draw attention to a vehicle in a positive way. Excessive volume ain't the way to do it. Think about it, pedestrians turning to look...
how many of those are a threat to you? 1%?

You draw excessive attention from those who are not `needing` to be informed of your presence but are merely negatively affected by it. Is that not like carpet-bombing with 70,000 lbs or iron bombs from a B-52 instead of a precision surgical strike with a laser-guided munition from a drone?

Just without the death part...

[Earl]

Without starting an argument how the hell do Harleys get away with their pipes then, I had a 2t pipe that was 10 decibels lower than a stock harley and was told it was illegal, go figure?????

Oh and about the point of reference to sound, wasn't this tried with sirens on ambulances so people could determine from which direction they were coming, that lasted a long time didn't it!