I bought a non lined Hi-vis jacket that fits over my bike jacket ,I cut the collar off as it would flap about and make a racket I also have a pair of Hi-vis waterproof over trousers but have not used them for a while. They are flexothane ones which are very light to wear and roll up small.

That's an interesting thought Mr Grumpy as I've just fitted a small top-box to my Sym, and looking at the bike from behind I guess much of the rider might be obscured. The scooter though, like most modern bikes, has a substantial red tail-light cluster and the top-box is silver with a large built-in rear-light-style reflector so actually increases its physical presence on the road, I would say. Fortunately, from the front or side (say on a roundabout), nothing is obscured, so Hi-vis jacket, Sam-Browne or whatever can be clearly seen.

Yeah, red tail lights / topbox reflectors are fine, but in traffic, they can be just another red light in a sea of other red lights!

Slightly off topic but still connected to being visible, a particular hate of mine is those car drivers who seem to find it good fun to fit smoked glass rear lights which have the effect of making them much less visible at night than would otherwise be the case. Why would you not want to be seen?

13Brads wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 1:45 pm Slightly off topic but still connected to being visible, a particular hate of mine is those car drivers who seem to find it good fun to fit smoked glass rear lights which have the effect of making them much less visible at night than would otherwise be the case. Why would you not want to be seen?

It's not just cars that have these. Some bikers think it's cool too, also some have those miniscule indicator lights. Madness really.

Du PontChardon wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 8:36 am I did once read of the open helmet/no helmet argument by, I think by some extremists at MAG - you know, that band of people who, since the 1970's, if you regularly paid your subscription to them, planned to influence certain libertarian politicians repeal the helmet law, stop the CBT and 125 learner restrictions, remove ABS on motorcycles etc etc.

Quite possibly written by me.

I don't wear hi viz any more, I used to before I retired. I had to take a hi-viz jacket/waistcoat to work and the easiest way was to wear it. I rely on defensive riding and it's served me well over the years. As for the open faced helmet I haven't worn one for at least thirty years, but I might buy one when my present one passes it's use by date. All my worst accidents were when wearing an open faced helmet wiith out it being too detrimental.
Having said that I did lose a fair amount of skin of the side of my face once, that was in 1967 and I've still got a small scar on the side of my nose. I also put a hole clean through the top of my helmet in that crash, Ever oak racemaster, best helmet you could buy at the time. So I bought another one, went and pick the bike up after it was repaired and wrote that helmet off on the way home, happy days I'm glad to say my riding skills have improved no end over the years, by the way the second accident wasnt my fault.

Still wear my "Sam Brite" cross belt that i have had over 30 years. I recall the police once telling me that, you need to brake up your outline, as people take notice of an unusual shape ,either coming towards them or, if they are following you.

Just as an addendum: I was in Durham City today (on the bus!) approaching the fast and very busy multiple-junction crossroads at Neville's Cross, when out of nowhere a Police Motorcyclist rapidly arrived - white bike, white helmet, hi-vis jacket and of course blue lights flashing - and instantly drew the attention of and instantly stopped all traffic by his appearance and demeanour. Three of his colleagues rode past at speed followed by three large civilian SUV's - presumably our political lords and masters - followed by another Police motorcycle. As the vehicles past by, the original motorcyclist joined them at the rear. It all happened in a flash, but no-one could have possibly said that they 'had not seen them' !

But was there a siren as well? That usually gets people's attention. I've seen people blindly ignore police cars with blue lights flashing before!
As for your visitation - the Tories must be holding a secret Xmas bash somewhere! Ushaw College? It'd be easy to lose a party in that place!